主题：道家武功学习记 -- 长河落日圆
- 复 目标
家园 过程一 交钱后先签个承诺书，不能把学到的东西用来进行商业活动，估计就是不能用他这里学到的东西再去教别人赚钱，免费教是可以的，这对我来说没有问题，我的目的是搞定我自己，最多是还有我的家人或者同事朋友，所以签了。
一开始学站桩，说是让我从形意入手，教了个桩法，我问叫什么桩，小师傅说是叫三体式，这我奇怪了，因为年青时对武术有点兴趣，形意的三体桩我还是知道的，跟这个姿势完全不同。我问小师傅，他笑着说外面书上的东西都不是真功夫。
- 复 过程一
家园 期待下文 - 复 期待下文
家园 过程二 开始站桩，一边站二十分钟，重心全部压在一只脚的脚跟上，双手摆一个姿势，在站桩过程中，手的姿势更重要，脚可以动，从左脚变换到右脚，但是手的姿势不能变，手的意不能断，我还算好，第一次咬牙站了十分钟，然后换脚，小师傅上来给我纠正姿势，一身大汗，大师傅看到我额头上的汗滴下来，问我滴到眼睛里辣不辣，我说辣，不知他问这话是什么意思，大师傅神秘的笑了笑就走了，果然有后话。练到现在十几天，昨晚练动桩，感觉滴到眼睛的汗水不辣了，于是练完后问大师傅，他给我说了一通从中医到西医的道理，听的我一愣一愣的，我可是正宗学过人体解剖及生理学的，好像有点道理。呵呵，先不解释，看看有没有那位河友能解释这个现象。
- 复 过程二
家园 我怎么站桩才能流汗? 能不能细说一下怎么站桩,没多少站桩基础,就是想跟你学一下,尝尝自己的汗水的辣味.
俺住在北方寒冷地带,冰天雪地的,即使有点暖气,想出点汗还是不象热带地区那么容易. 这盐不能通过汗排泄,只能尿出去,健康会有问题.
家园 姿势对了 出汗是没问题的。这要师傅在傍边给你纠正姿势，师傅有一个观点，人是会自动偷懒的，也可以称之为一种适应，偷懒了你都不知道。我练了一段时间然后跟师傅说我现在站桩不出汗了，大师傅看了我一眼，又偷懒了。于是小师傅上来给我纠正姿势。
- 复 过程二
家园 楼主 继续啊 - 复 过程二
家园 汗多了,盐不能及时补充.皇家空军航空医药所1956论文 The concentration of sodium in thermal sweatM. G. Bulmer and G. D. Forwell
1956
生理盐水含盐0.9%, 而海水平均含盐3.5%.
人类祖先离开大海(百万年或数亿年前)时海水的含盐0.9%.
后来雨水把更多的盐份带入大海,直到今天海水平均含盐3.5%.
Salinity of saline solutionsHow salty are sweat, tears and that stuff that you use to soak your contact lenses compared to, like, the ocean?
--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back (talk) 15:09, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
The salinity of sweat is examined in this paper by Bulmer and Forwell. It depends on the sweat rate, but seems to be between 30 and 120 molar equivalents per litre.
Sancho 15:23, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
The salinity of seawater is about 3.5%. Most of that's sodium chloride. Tears have the same osmolality as the body's internal fluids, containing a mixture of salts. (An isoosmotic solution of sodium chloride – as used in normal medical saline solution – contains about 0.9% sodium chloride: about 150 millimolar.)
TenOfAllTrades(talk) 17:13, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
salinity of bodily fluids is the same as the salinity the ocean was, when our distant ancestors crawled out of it; they had to carry that environment around with them for their cells to function. meanwhile, however, the earth continued to wash minerals down off the land into the ocean, so that now it is much saltier than it was then, and than we are; and the organisms that stayed behind have had to adapt to that.
Gzuckier (talk) 18:27, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
The same as when our ancestors crawled out of the ocean? Are you sure? Wouldn't it be more likely to be the same as when cellular life forms established a clear separation between what was inside and what was outside the cell, i.e. some two billion instead of 500 million years ago? Or possibly when multicellular life evolved? See Timeline of evolution. I was unable to find any source internally or externally about rate at which ocean salinity has risen. Is anything known at all on such large time scales?
--NorwegianBlue talk 20:41, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
Ocean life is good at expelling salt from the interiors of their cells. I think a better scientific explanation is that there is an ideal salinity for certain biochemical processes, and the cell tries to maintain that level.
Nimur (talk) 22:46, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Thank you. And now for another salty question....
Do all salts taste "salty?" Are there any edible, nutritious salts besides NaCl?
--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back (talk) 17:49, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
'Nutritious' is a matter of quantity. Chronic excess consumption of sodium chloride is linked to high blood pressure, heart disease, and other ailments. Acute overdoses of sodium chloride can be fatal.
To answer the question you're probably asking, potassium chloride is often used as a salt substitute for individuals on sodium-restricted diets. Its oral toxicity is quite low (comparable to that of sodium chloride).
TenOfAllTrades(talk) 17:56, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
What are the most toxic salts? Are they salty as well?
--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back (talk) 18:01, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
You'll have to test and report back.
On a somewhat more serious note, there are a lot of different salts, and they will have a wide range of tastes. Salts of zinc reportedly have a bitter, astringent flavour. Cyanide salts have an odour of almonds—tasting is discouraged. Calcium carbonate is the bulk of most calcium antacids; it has a chalky taste. Sodium citrate is acidic and tart. Alkaline salts may have a soapy taste or mouthfeel. The list is practically endless.
TenOfAllTrades(talk) 19:24, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Also see Taste#Saltiness, which could use references.
--Allen (talk) 20:19, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
I stumbled upon a paper on this subject recently, but I'll be damned if I can remember what keywords I was searching the journals with. If I recall, it's the chloride anion which actually triggers the "salty" flavour, and different counterions (sodium, potassium, etc.) affect how strongly salty something may taste. If I find the article, I'll get back to you.
Sockatume (talk) 01:37, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
check out Sea Salt. That tends to have all kinds of salts mixed up in it.
Furmanj (talk) 01:54, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
Also check out Salt (chemistry)#Tastes.
Sockatume: from personal experience, potassium chloride tastes much saltier than sodium chloride and has a very unpleasant aftertaste. Calcium carbonate has no taste. Potassium nitrate, the main component in gunpowder, tastes slightly alkaline. Sodium bicarbonate, baking soda, also tastes alkaline and sodium carbonate is unbearably so. Lithium oxide turns into lithium hydroxide upon contacting water, and therefore tastes very caustic. Iron oxide is obviously tasteless. Again, all of this is from personal experience and may not be reliable.
--Bowlhover (talk) 06:42, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
Other edible salts include Epsom salts and sal ammoniac. Magnesium chloride tastes more salty than salt, and Calcium chloride is pretty harmless. potassium sulphate and sodium sulphate taste less salty but are also harmless in small quantities. PS don't eat lithium oxide or lithium hydroxide as they are very damaging to flesh.
Graeme Bartlett (talk) 12:18, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
Yes, don't eat sodium carbonate either. It is used as washing soda and tastes extremely, extremely alkaline.
--Bowlhover (talk) 17:26, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
That is superb--tasting notes for salts of every sort. I love the Science reference desk.
--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back (talk) 02:21, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
There was an episode of Good Eats that focused on salt, it aired back in 2004. Alton Brown talked about all the different kinds of salts depending on where they come from, how they're processed, etc...
-- MacAddct 1984 (talk contribs) 15:03, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
I love Alton Brown. But I'm sure he was talking about different kinds of table salt. I was asking about different types of chemical salts.
--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back (talk) 02:21, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
See also Monosodium glutamate (MSG), also known as E621. It is used as a food additive because it stimulates the umami taste receptors. I heard a story on this podcast that suggested a link between the huge increase in the consumption of MSG and the obesity epidemic, based on studies in rats, but according to our article, this correlation was not found in humans.
--NorwegianBlue talk 22:02, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
I am confused by the claim that iron oxide is flavorless. Rusty nails taste different from plain nails, and the difference is iron oxide.
Edison (talk) 05:30, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
Sorry, iron oxide is not flavourless. It has a mild taste that I can't accurately describe; it's been a long time since I've tasted rust.
--Bowlhover (talk) 17:26, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
Salts of heavy metals such as lead are very toxic (often more toxic than the pure metal). See Lead(II) chromate, for example.
Nimur (talk) 22:47, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
家园 其他动物是否也象人类一样需要补充盐份维持生命? 假如汗水和泪水都含有同样的盐份,那流泪的时候也没觉得辣啊? 可见汗水里另外有东西刺激眼睛,有盐没盐,有多少盐都不是主要因素.
但是为什么只有人类才需要补充盐份? 准备另开帖讨论这个话题.
有人提出人类在进化过程中,由海上岸,又返回到海,再重新上岸.
这是否导致人类是唯一需要补充盐份才能维持生命的哺乳动物?
人体血液中就带有这种海水特有的稍咸的味道。当你在进食时，如果不慎咬破舌头，伤口流出了血，你就尝到了血的咸味。经测定，人血的含盐度，一般为1%左右，比普通海水的平均含盐度（3%～3．5%）要低一些，但比世界上最淡的波罗的海的含盐度（0.2%～0.3%）却要高许多。况且，科学家在考察地球历史中发现，在原始生命诞生时期，海洋中并没有那么多的盐分，比之今日要低得多。之后大陆上的盐分逐渐随水流注入海洋，海水才慢慢变得咸起来。而在鱼类进化到两栖类，并由海中登上陆地的时候，其咸度就相当于现在人血的咸度。会不会是因为人类的远祖在登陆时只带上了当时的海中物质，并以此代代相继，所以人血的含盐度就比现在的海水要低一些呢？这个道理在医学上得到了普遍承认。当人体因某种疾病而大量失水时，或者出血过多时，医生的首要任务就是给患者皮下或静脉中注射生理盐水，最常用的是含0.85%氯化钠的水溶液。炎热的夏天，在地里劳动的农民和在炼钢炉前干活的工人，每天都要流掉大量的汗水，出汗过多，人的机体就会因失水失钠而致病，医生总是要劝这些人多喝些淡盐开水。这就是向人体内部“海洋”中补充“海水”，是维持生命所必需的。
家园 食草动物需要舔舐盐碱土 牧民每个月要给放牧的牲畜喂盐，把大颗粒的粗盐，颗粒平均比黄豆大一点，撒在地上，让牲畜添进嘴里
家园 大象也要吃盐 黑猫警长里说的
- 复 大象也要吃盐
家园 盐和水同样重要,身体需要保持血液含盐量不变 Salt is as necessary to life as water. In many areas of Africa people once drank the urine of animals because they had no other source of salt. Without salt, human beings die.像水一样，盐是生命所必需的。在许多的非洲地区人们曾经喝过动物的尿液,因为他们没有其他盐的来源。没有盐,人会死亡。外链出处The human body demands that the amount of salt in the blood always stay the same. When the body does not get enough salt, it protects itself by letting less salt leave the body in urine and sweat. But it cannot reduce this output to zero. Some salt is always escaping. 人体需要血液中盐的含量保持不变。当身体不能获得足够的盐,它可以使尿液和汗水少排盐。但不能降低到零,要损失掉一些盐.
On a completely saltless diet, like that of some people in Africa, the body steadily loses small amounts of salt through the kidneys and sweat glands. It then tries to adjust to this loss by speeding up its secretion of water. In this way, the body attempts to keep the amount of salt in the blood at the necessary level. The result is a slow drying up of body and, finally, death. The person dies of thirst.在完全无盐可食的地方,如非洲,身体通过肾脏和汗腺不断失去少量盐分。然后释放(分泌)水分来平衡盐损失。身体试图这样来保持血液中必需的盐含量。结果是身体缓慢干涸,最终死亡。因干渴而死亡。
In cases where there is little or no water to drink, the body tries to do the opposite thing. Again, it must keep the salt level in the blood constant. Because it has little water, it attempts to stop water from leaving the body and to increase its secretion of salt. But, as with the escaping salt, it cannot be completely successful. Some water still leaves and the person eventually dies of thirst. In short, the body’s normal needs for salt and for water are both parts of the same important need to keep the salt level in the blood constant.在没有或者很少有水可喝的情况下,身体试图要做的刚好相反。为了保持血液中盐含量不变,它试图阻止水离开身体,增排盐量。但和缺盐的情况一样,如果不能成功,水分还是损失掉了,人终究死于干渴。简而言之,盐和水同样重要,身体需要保持血液含盐量不变。
水生态
一般水生脊椎动物的体液盐分浓度大都达到海水的1/4至1/3上下人0.9%,海水3.5% 刚好1/4
人的祖先登陆后的几十万年,海水变的更咸了的说法不成立.
家园 这个比较难说 不过看化石数据应该可以的哦
家园 呵呵，皇家空军的论文都出来了 大师傅说的中医的意思我有点不大清楚，跟心，气血，脏腑，津液有关，西医的意思是一般人是酸性体质，经常出汗的话就把人体内一些有毒的酸性物质通过皮肤排出来，排的多了，身体的有毒物质就少了，所以排出来的汗液中酸性物质就少了，所以就不那么辣眼了，我听得一头雾水中回想当年学的人体生理的知识，人体的排泄主要是通过尿液，汗液，有毒的物质，比如说尿素，主要是通过尿液排出，也有一些是通过汗液排出，这样大师傅的理论好像也是说的过去，他倒是没有提到汗液中盐分的问题，只是统称为酸性物质，有毒物质。我惊讶的是他一个小学毕业生，只是练武，何以了解这么多的人体生理知识，不像是传统观念中的大老粗武夫形象。